Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation



  • Ever heard of overpopulation? Bet you did. I've heard people talk about it for all my life now. And that is pretty crazy, because the key information I'm going to present you, is actually older than me, and it's freely available to anyone...

    The global birth rate, that is the number of children born every year, has been declining since 1950. Currently the earth's population increases by 1.06% every year. This number decreases with the decline of birth rates, and it will eventually reach zero and then become negative. This will likely happen around the year 2050. Then we will have a population of around 9 billion people. This will be the peak. After that it will in all likelyhood go down.

    71 percent of Earth's land surface is defined as habitable. Humans use half of global habitable area for agricultural production (of the remainder, 37 percent is forested; 11 percent as shrubbery; and only 1% is utilised as urban infrastructure). [from ourworldindata.org]

    So, by landmass, we definitely do not have an overpopulation, and we won't have either. We might be concentrated a bit much in certain places (mega-cities around the world)...

    So what about food? We use 77% of what we produce in agriculture to feed our lifestock. 67% of what we eat comes from plants, 30% from meat. Keep these numbers in mind for we are able to feed 7.5 billion people right now!

    The math I'm going to do here is not 100% clean. If somebody wants to clean it up please feel free to do so. I'm just trying to roughly estimate a number here to bring my point accross.

    To feed 9 billion people we have to create roughly 30% more food in total. How could we do that? Well, simply use 30% of the grain we produce, which currently goes into our lifestock, for people instead. This would mean, by eating 40% less meat, we could easily feed everyone.

    And say, we wanted to have more people on the planet :joy:? How many could it support if we only eat meat on sundays say? This would mean we'd roughly only use 11% of agricultural land for livestock and thus 89% for crops that we can eat. This would allow us to feed 19 billion people.

    Overpopulation is a myth.

    But don't be misslead. The actual problem is of course how to distribute all of the earths resources. And I have shown you only one example: food. There are others, but those too can be solved. So stop believing the doomsayers. And start working on the problems instead. The number of people is not the problem. The number of people won't even get close to being the problem...

    Land-use-graphic-01-small.png



  • Don't have biological children.
    Adopt someone in need.
    Aaandddd,
    I wonder how all of you can write so much!!



  • @petrapark3r I agree with @DAD_ . We are smart, we will find a way to provide for our growing population even if it seems impossible. That's what we do. That is our job. However, its not the feeding them and providing for them that is the problem.
    Its the devastation we will cause from being over populated. Sure, we can provide for all humanity, but when doing so we kill off so much of Earths natural life. We are already going through a world water crisis and an incredible decline in the amount of fishable sea food.
    We can fix our problems that we have created, we don't have to be doomed.
    But in all honesty, I think we already are. I think were already on the path of doom but were walking at the beginning so we don't see the devastation we will arrive to at the end.
    We don't have to be doomed, but the likely hood of anyone giving a rats butt about our planet and the life on it to actually improve not just the life of humans but for all living things-our earth as well- is almost 0.


  • Music Lovers

    @petrapark3r

    The dangerous thing isn't overpopulation,
    But the over-exploitation by the limited population.

    There will surely be a stagnation point in the population growth curve, as the technology increases, so does the medical facilities. And hence, the infant mortality rate decreases, and people in the under-developed states, reproduce less.

    Now to the topic;

    The biggest flaw of statistics is that it takes everything to be ideal.

    All the numbers you have, is based upon this assumption that everything will be fine; No natural disasters, No all out wars.

    So what about food? We use 77% of what we produce in agriculture to feed our lifestock. 67% of what we eat comes from plants, 30% from meat. Keep these numbers in mind for we are able to feed 7.5 billion people right now!

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/sep/12/third-of-earths-soil-acutely-degraded-due-to-agriculture-study
    This study tells that, 24 Billion tonnes of arable land, goes to waste each year due to intensive farming. In the words of The UN Head;

    Screenshot 2019-07-17 at 18.15.51.png

    So, if we are able to feed (in an ideal situation that is) 7.5 billion people each year now, I doubt that will be the case in the upcoming years.

    Another study by the UN states that;

    Screenshot 2019-07-17 at 18.28.24.png
    https://www.unccd.int/news-events/land-degradation-growing-threat-global-security

    Now to the 30% Meat part;

    Though, it constitutes to only a menial amount of our diet, but the negative and destructive impact it has on the environment is absolutely devastating.

    Screenshot 2019-07-17 at 18.34.56.png
    http://www.fao.org/3/a-a0701e.pdf (the UN report)

    Overpopulation is a myth.

    Indeed it is. But the impact the limited stagnated population will have on the planet's resources will be far worse.

    But don't be misslead. The actual problem is of course how to distribute all of the earths resources. And I have shown you only one example: food. There are others, but those too can be solved.

    Indeed it is.
    But, let's not forget the elephant in the room here, which I have already mentioned in my above point.
    Even if the number of people isn't the problem, but the way those people act.
    The reckless way, in which they destroy and exploit the resources.
    That my friend, will be our doom.



  • images-7.jpeg
    Jokes aside I completely agree with you on the fact that 'overpoulation is a myth' infact it has become an incentive for people to stop it and there has been seen a boost in the economy as well. I mean there are probably many things which we can't solve and overpopulation is Not one of them. We can surely come up and control our population( now who's interested in living like trash in the near future) by introducing sound policies and plans. What's gotten me more worried is the fact that we are exploiting the resources...I mean we obviously have the renewable ones to replace them but not everything can be replaced.



  • @DAD_ said in Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation:

    @petrapark3r

    The dangerous thing isn't overpopulation,
    But the over-exploitation by the limited population.

    There will surely be a stagnation point in the population growth curve, as the technology increases, so does the medical facilities. And hence, the infant mortality rate decreases, and people in the under-developed states, reproduce less.

    Now to the topic;

    The biggest flaw of statistics is that it takes everything to be ideal.

    All the numbers you have, is based upon this assumption that everything will be fine; No natural disasters, No all out wars.

    :joy: funny that you should mention those two things. Because you know, natural disasters and all out wars will have one effect: they will decrease the population drastically. So, as cold as this might sound, but these things would actually make it easier even.

    So what about food? We use 77% of what we produce in agriculture to feed our lifestock. 67% of what we eat comes from plants, 30% from meat. Keep these numbers in mind for we are able to feed 7.5 billion people right now!

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/sep/12/third-of-earths-soil-acutely-degraded-due-to-agriculture-study
    This study tells that, 24 Billion tonnes of arable land, goes to waste each year due to intensive farming. In the words of The UN Head;

    Screenshot 2019-07-17 at 18.15.51.png

    So, if we are able to feed (in an ideal situation that is) 7.5 billion people each year now, I doubt that will be the case in the upcoming years.

    Yeah, that is one of the problems that needs solving. However I don't actually know how much 24 billion tonnes are, and I don't quite understand even why this would be measured in tonnes in the first place instead of square kilometers. Maybe to make the number sound bigger?

    Another study by the UN states that;

    Screenshot 2019-07-17 at 18.28.24.png
    https://www.unccd.int/news-events/land-degradation-growing-threat-global-security

    But yeah, this is one of the things where we should put our research resources to. You know what my take on those problems is? The best investment, the UN and anybody could ever make in any country is in its youth. Education people. That is where most of the money should go, so that soon some genius arises to find a technique to make that land arable again.

    Now to the 30% Meat part;

    Though, it constitutes to only a menial amount of our diet, but the negative and destructive impact it has on the environment is absolutely devastating.

    Yes, it acctually amounts to 14.5 % of our CO² emissions. Ergo reducing global meat consumption might actually be a good idea in many ways :grin:

    Screenshot 2019-07-17 at 18.34.56.png
    http://www.fao.org/3/a-a0701e.pdf (the UN report)

    Overpopulation is a myth.

    Indeed it is. But the impact the limited stagnated population will have on the planet's resources will be far worse.

    But don't be misslead. The actual problem is of course how to distribute all of the earths resources. And I have shown you only one example: food. There are others, but those too can be solved.

    Indeed it is.
    But, let's not forget the elephant in the room here, which I have already mentioned in my above point.
    Even if the number of people isn't the problem, but the way those people act.
    The reckless way, in which they destroy and exploit the resources.
    That my friend, will be our doom.

    It might be the doom of our global society, but people have lived for hundreds of thousands of years without oil and the like.

    But I do want to question wether it will actually be our doom too. I'll continue to make topics like this, to tackle the different questions around this issue. But let me just say this:

    Current estimates say that oil in traditional sources will run out in 150 years. However there is a huge amount of oil bound in sand. Currently acquireing this oil is uneconomical. But the moment, that the other way is no longer viable, it will become economical pretty fast. Not saying we should continue to increase our oil consumption though...

    Another thing to note is: We know that our actions pose a problem for the planet since about 50 years. In this timeframe

    • a small car's gasoline consumtion went down from 20 liters / 100 km to 5 liters (my car actually drinks 5 liters!).
    • electric cars were invented. And they will soon be everywhere, because they are soooooooooooooo much fun to drive. Can you hear my longing? I drove a BMW i3 back when I studied (the school had a shared one, it was an advertising campaign). 180 PS (horsepower) right when you hit the pedal. :drooling_face: :drooling_face: :drooling_face:. And somebody took me on a ride with a 400 PS Tesla. :drooling_face: x10. so anyways...
    • in germany there are quite a few houses that are self sufficient
    • on a hot summer day, all of germanies energy consumption comes from renewable resources
    • other countries also do things. Especially china has discovered that caring for the environment is a good thing... Long ways to go, but still.

    So. Point is. We are getting there... I'm not so sure we are doomed...



  • @Sup said in Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation:

    Don't have biological children.
    Adopt someone in need.
    Aaandddd,
    I wonder how all of you can write so much!!

    No such thing as overpopulation :shrug: Have your own children. Especially if you live in a western country. Germans are dying out. Period...


  • SPARTAN Fake Moderators We Are Groot! Global Moderator

    @Sup MY FRIEND HAD A PROJECT ON OVERPOPULATION AND SHE FAILED IT BECAUSE ITS A PRETTY HARD CONCEPT BUT AH YOURE RIGHT


  • Soul Searchers

    @petrapark3r thank you for your theory test. Yes the data is there, but by that alone Americans Should Be the welthiest on the planet per debt to income ratio. Is it true? No. In college, I was taught that these factors were "realistic numbers". Only true if EVERYTHING listed holds true. Example; I am on a limited income of roughly $800 USA with a margin of error +/- 20%. With 67% going to rent/food/medical treatment. That leaves less than 30% left, giving me an ability to invest or save this. Does this prove true ALL the time? How about your own income? Because the Federal Income Bracket/ Gross National Income and the Federal Trade Commission say I should be topping over $10,000 a month in my Savings account.



  • @OliveOlivia said in Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation:

    @petrapark3r when theres 7.5 billion people and growing, the number is almost 0. I didn't say 0. If you want to get technical its like 0.01%. as I said, we can fix it. There is salvation. I just know it wont happen and that's just facts, sadly.

    Take india for example. Today, virtually no child dies of hunger. This was by far not the case 20 years ago. We have made enormous progress. But. Not dying of hunger, and having the luxury of having time for other things than work during your days, are 2 different things. Point here is, that most of the people on the planet, do not have the luxury to worry about the planet. But as you can see, we are moving in the right direction. And the internet is reaching millions of new people every day. This is why I said we have to push developing countries over the limit, where they can and will start worrying about the planet. And we are getting there. It feels really close. Well, in global society "close" sense, e.g. the next 50 years, we might already see big changes.



  • @OliveOlivia said in Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation:

    @petrapark3r I agree with @DAD_ . We are smart, we will find a way to provide for our growing population even if it seems impossible. That's what we do. That is our job. However, its not the feeding them and providing for them that is the problem.
    Its the devastation we will cause from being over populated. Sure, we can provide for all humanity, but when doing so we kill off so much of Earths natural life. We are already going through a world water crisis and an incredible decline in the amount of fishable sea food.

    Yeah, there are problems and we have to solve them. Overfishing is a big one. The oceans are actually the one place that we are fucking up most. But we can solve them. Did you know that 98% of all garbage in the oceans comes from asian countries? E.g. we (as in murrica and europe) are actually doing pretty good.

    And here is the solution hidden btw. Once a country reaches a certain stage of development it starts caring. Especially the people who live in the big cities do. So. What we should do is speed up the under-developed countries to the point, where their cities start working for the environment and no longer against it.

    We can fix our problems that we have created, we don't have to be doomed.
    But in all honesty, I think we already are. I think were already on the path of doom but were walking at the beginning so we don't see the devastation we will arrive to at the end.

    Yeah, path of doom. Agree. We are on that. In many different ways. But we're also working on leaving it. Many of us are.

    We don't have to be doomed, but the likely hood of anyone giving a rats butt about our planet and the life on it to actually improve not just the life of humans but for all living things-our earth as well- is almost 0.

    I have seen so amazing initiatives, movies, campaigns... 0 is definitely not the number I would have put there...



  • @Connor27 said in Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation:

    @Sup MY FRIEND HAD A PROJECT ON OVERPOPULATION AND SHE FAILED IT BECAUSE ITS A PRETTY HARD CONCEPT BUT AH YOURE RIGHT

    I'm pretty sure what I wrote up there might have made me fail too. Cause teachers these days can be quite ideologically posessed... The good teachers of course not... They are able to give you a good grade based on wether you can support your claims with arguments, even if they would disagree with your opinion...


  • SPARTAN Fake Moderators We Are Groot! Global Moderator

    @petrapark3r Sadly, I have no good teachers :(



  • @Connor27 said in Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation:

    @petrapark3r Sadly, I have no good teachers :(

    Wow, I didn't know things were so bad! Not a single good teacher :scream:. What is this world coming to?

    Let's pay them more! Honestly. Pay teachers more. Then better people will take the job. And the bad people will have to become activists instead...


  • SPARTAN Fake Moderators We Are Groot! Global Moderator

    @petrapark3r exactly! And no, I haven’t had a good teacher since preschool (I miss it so much 😪😪😪😪)



  • Fascinating. Glad I read this cos I was about to write my will & testament and leave my body to the Soylent Green factory.

    What will the hobbledhoy do instead of having kids? I think they'll spend the whole time writing Fortnite fan fiction, and it'll get so sophisticated, it'll be like a Samuel Beckett play but with Fortnite combatants.



  • @Anastasia-Smith said in Fact check with Pet: Overpopulation:

    images-7.jpeg
    Jokes aside I completely agree with you on the fact that 'overpoulation is a myth' infact it has become an incentive for people to stop it and there has been seen a boost in the economy as well. I mean there are probably many things which we can't solve and overpopulation is Not one of them. We can surely come up and control our population( now who's interested in living like trash in the near future) by introducing sound policies and plans. What's gotten me more worried is the fact that we are exploiting the resources...

    Yap that is a problem, and we need to deal with it.

    I mean we obviously have the renewable ones to replace them but not everything can be replaced.

    I'm not so sure that's true. New technologies will keep being invented. Especially when it's economically feasible to invest into that development. Like Lithium-Ion batteries for example, they have become so incredibly powerful because there was a demand on the market.



  • @petrapark3r when theres 7.5 billion people and growing, the number is almost 0. I didn't say 0. If you want to get technical its like 0.01%. as I said, we can fix it. There is salvation. I just know it wont happen and that's just facts, sadly.



  • @petrapark3r What I meant was that there are little possibilities for everything. I did not mean that new things won't be invented to replace the old ones, obv they will. I'm just worried cuz of the bleak possibility of things not working the way we will want them to in the future. Thats all. But maybe they will. Who knows.


  • tws gay club but no homo Watch Anime Eyes Gamers

    @petrapark3r
    after reading half I thought this planet needs thanos more than ironman. but I guess yeah. not all people get facilities/food as they need to. sounds like lack of supply not lack of production.
    u said increasing rate is 1.06% is that after subtracting decreasing(death) rate or before that?
    n I noticed tags this time 😇👌.






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