helloooooooo?
Is Capitalism Evil? [The Rise of Reason I]
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@pe7erpark3r "Controlled capitalism" is probably the best. I mean entrepreneurs should be able to make enough profit but a limit of making profit should also be legally fixed which will stop them from making too much profit.
These limits of profit can be extended under certain conditions. For example, if an entrepreneur has reached his first limit of profit then the limit will be extended as a reward after 5 years under the condition that he will have to financially help 100 poor families to become financially established. And in this way, the limit of profit can be continuously extended.Also people who are not poor could be legally made to spend a small percentage of their income completely for the poor. Rate of bank interest can be gradually reduced as well.
Inequality of income is okay but it also needs to be made sure that nobody is poor enough.
Hecovered
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@pe7erpark3r Clarity of thought and information. An economic system should never have a deep divide between the rich and poor, and hopefully onward to build an upgraded form of human centered capitalism where we insist that the markets serve human interests for all of us, not just generate wealth for some. It seems that most people, on both sides, are too narrow to understand that humans function with both cooperation and competition.. But, that's how politics works! Money on the other hand is just about social hierarchy.
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@sarah_the_magpie said in Is Capitalism Evil?:
@pe7erpark3r
i think that capitalism is a good servant, but a lousy master.that's a good way to put it.
in theory, it's a wonderful invention. capitalism is very efficient and self-sustaining. it rewards people who are willing to work hard & smart and punishes those who aren't. greed is in human nature indeed, and capitalism is a great way to harness it & make it work for the betterment of all.
still, this is a natural phenomenon, not an invention.
however, nowadays it seems like capitalism isn't functioning the way it's supposed to. money is being concentrated at the top, which is bad news for us ordinary people.
This is how this part of our nature always works. It has always been like this, wealth was always concentrating at the top, and that was always bad news.
i agree, communism is certainly not the solution, but something drastic must definitely be done to augment & repair capitalism.
i do think that some degree of socialism and/or state intervention is required to spread wealth more equally.My thoughts also lean this way. In fact, and I will write about this soon, I think that here we have this force of nature, gainst whose bad sides we must throw another weight. In fact I think, that the state's task is actually this, to lean against the weight of this nature, and work in the opposite direction, pushing wealth and power down again. Balance it out.
billionaires should be taxed more deliberately, and companies must be held accountable for the well-being of their workers. UBI, profit sharing & responsible growth should be the key words.
equality of outcome is impossible to achieve,
nor is it necessary or good, except when it naturally happens, but that's another big topic.
but equality of opportunity for everyone is something we should all strive for. no one should be left behind :)
Yes.
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@Masih said in Is Capitalism Evil?:
@pe7erpark3r "Controlled capitalism" is probably the best.
The keyword is social markets.
I mean entrepreneurs should be able to make enough profit but a limit of making profit should also be legally fixed which will stop them from making too much profit.
These limits of profit can be extended under certain conditions. For example, if an entrepreneur has reached his first limit of profit then the limit will be extended as a reward after 5 years under the condition that he will have to financially help 100 poor families to become financially established. And in this way, the limit of profit can be continuously extended.However the regulation has to be done in a very sophisticated way. E.g. the system must be build from the ground up, to balance out the negative effects of capitalism, while still allowing for the good ones at every level.
By which I mean, the rules should not be complicated or arbitrary. A fixed limit of profit is something politicians would do indeed. But I think the limit should not be fixed. The system should simply be designed such, that the higher you rise, the greater is the power that withstands your further rise. With every step. And the more wealth you generate, the more wealth is distributed. I'll explain my idea in great detail in another post.
Also people who are not poor could be legally made to spend a small percentage of their income completely for the poor.
This is actually what the tax system does in western states. The state does help the poor.
Rate of bank interest can be gradually reduced as well.
These days in europe banks even pay you, to take their credit. Seriously. I wonder when this thing collapses...
Inequality of income is okay but it also needs to be made sure that nobody is poor enough.
Yeah, that is one of the natural effects of the distripution of wealth, that people are thrown out of the game. Indeed we should make sure, that nobody is thrown out, or left alone.
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@kaia_ said in Is Capitalism Evil?:
@pe7erpark3r Clarity of thought and information. An economic system should never have a deep divide between the rich and poor, and hopefully onward to build an upgraded form of human centered capitalism where we insist that the markets serve human interests for all of us, not just generate wealth for some.
Let's design a system, that balances out nature. Totally my idea as well :yum:
It seems that most people, on both sides, are too narrow to understand that humans function with both cooperation and competition..
Oh so true.
But, that's how politics works!
Yes and no. 20 years ago, politicians were still able to talk and think without being "ripped apart". Today everything is turned into a scandal by the media, the ideological divide is greater than ever...
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@pe7erpark3r So we can say that it is good as long as we avoid manipulations at any level and by any group. Market forces will helpful if the rules are properly followed, then we need to change our consumer behaviour, and teach the children right.
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@kaia_ said in Is Capitalism Evil?:
@pe7erpark3r So we can say that it is good as long as we avoid manipulations at any level and by any group. Market forces will helpful if the rules are properly followed, then we need to change our consumer behaviour, and teach the children right.
We won't avoid manipulations. I'm a realist, not a dreamer. People will manipulate. However this is an important topic indeed: virtue. And I will write something about that too, because it actually does play a big role in politics too. Because no matter how good the system is, the more people do evil in society, the more definite it becomes that the system breaks. You cannot mitigate immorality except by fighting immorality itself in the place where it sits: the individual!
We can't avoid manipulations, but we can and should put mechanisms in place, that minimize the effects of a single manipulation. We also need mechanisms that favor transparency, however not forgetting that secret meeting too are an essential part of making politics.
You mentioned another important issue: groups. People form lobbies. They push their own interests. This is also natural and has both good and bad effects on society. We will talk about this too in one of the upcoming articles...
Changing consumer behaviour is an important task indeed. We do need morals, and we need to give our children a framework in which they can safely work their way as they grow, deal with things one at a time.
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Hi there
Communism is a theory that has been created by capitalism, however it never executed nowhere on this planet. USSR was not communist when Lenin took the power he though the country is not ready for it and came up with "Capital state". He made everything public. By that he could make a poor country like Russia to a super power. However he didn't distribute power back to people and that was his problem and Stalin took advantage of it. Nowadays countries which claim to be communist are actually pure capitalist with the banner of communism! example: china, north Korea and so on. These things that you mentioned like:"
it seems fair, that people who do more should have more
it seems fair, that people who take more responsibility should get a greater reward
it seems fair, that risking what you have should result in a reward for you
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These are the goals of communism too! However the problems lies within unjust nature of capitalism, for example by privatization there will be no school left for poor to learn and contribute to grow and make something out of him/her self and others.
You may say so his/her parent should have money to send their children to private schools. But it's not their fault. For example when capitalist system took everything that was public and privatized it and gave it the rich and you may say so the rich had the money and so be it. Then I say please search for "primitive accumulation" for more info, so you know how that rich guy became rich in the first place.
And i can go on and on about this topic and in the end there is no solution right now, because everything is so tangled into each other so you can not fix something without breaking another thing. Right now the smartest people thinking about this situation and they could not figure it out.
As Marx said " Criticism has plucked the imaginary flowers on the chain not in order that man shall continue to bear that chain without fantasy or consolation, but so that he shall throw off the chain and pluck the living flower.” So lets get rid of false hope or "imaginary flowers " to see the real chain on our feet. -
@kaia_ said in Is Capitalism Evil? [The Rise of Reason I]:
@pe7erpark3r Clarity of thought and information. An economic system should never have a deep divide between the rich and poor, and hopefully onward to build an upgraded form of human centered capitalism where we insist that the markets serve human interests for all of us, not just generate wealth for some. It seems that most people, on both sides, are too narrow to understand that humans function with both cooperation and competition.. But, that's how politics works! Money on the other hand is just about social hierarchy.
watch this vdieo from Vsauce and give your opinion about it:
it has some flaws BTW, but its a great start for continuing this argument.
After you gave your opinion, I will give you my opinoin. -
@winston4mg I think he's explaining the evolutionary history for how a community of people can come together to reach an acceptable conclusion by balancing the outliers. Am I right?
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@kaia_ said in Is Capitalism Evil? [The Rise of Reason I]:
@winston4mg I think he's explaining the evolutionary history for how a community of people can come together to reach an acceptable conclusion by balancing the outliers. Am I right?
yes you are completely right. However there is a downside to this particular idea "lottocracy".
First i should explain Socrates's view on democracy; He said democracy doesn't work because not everyone has the same knowledge (awareness) as everyone else, and this void of Knowledge (awareness) gets filed with advertising and superstition. It's like 10 person, 8 sheeps and 2 humans vote for where to live and the 8 sheeps vote for barns! Democracy is not for all people it's for majority and most of the time majority fooled with superstitions and advertising [because of lack of knowledge (awareness)].
Second because of "primitive accumulation" there is always a rich guy behind every society. For simplification we call them elites.
Therefor because elites have everything on their control, the theaters, the TV stations, the channels, the education and ... . they can manipulate the overall reasoning of all.
So i thinks lottocracy doesn't work either. But life is an struggle, we stumble along the way, and i think this one is good struggle which we could fight for.
don't you think?
