Interfaith Conversations!

[Xandoré_BG]

Every Religion, to be considered one as a matter of fact has to have some sort of attempt of "reconnecting" the human being to a "higher entity" in order to give the fortunate individual another way to enjoy its life experience. I dont think it was supposed to "bind" humanity together, except by the fact that all those "reconnected" humans would, logically, have the same goals and way of perceiving reality. So it was always about individualy achieving something greater than creating a "community" of sorts. IMO, that's human meddling. Every religion has that element of making an Individual closer to "something greater" than him, and transforming him in the process.

[Kaho]

@Div
where can I buy or rent geeta to read ? I mean is there any trustable online source ?
p.s. PDF bhi chl jayegi 😂

[pe7erpark3r]

@Div said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@pe7erpark3r
Currently reading this book to understand the similarities between christianity and dharma, cause after reading most of the book you recommended me(True life in god), I observed that there are indeed many intersection of ideas.

Yeah, I too found in the Geeta some striking resemblences of what true christian prayer is.

You know that most christians do not know what makes christianity convincing right? Well I do know a few of the reasons... and we can talk about them in detail if you want.

I feel a bit of the convincing power of Hinduism, especially since it has a way of integrating everything. There is something in it for everyone. There is one god, origin of all creation, and there are many gods, there is salvation that gets you into a higher plane of being, a wealthier one, or one where you are closer to the truth. And there is salvation that gets you directly to god. So, especially concerning the fact that one can actually experience the christian god very directly and personally, the fact that Hinduism can simply incorporate such experiences definitely gives it some convincing power.

What I've been rather curious about the last year however is another religion: Islam. I find Islam rather odd, for I have not found anything so far that could have convinced me of its truth. The more I've learned about it, the less convincing it seems. But, I don't really have a good angle on it, I don't think I know islam or the quran well at all. I know a few things, some bad, some good. So I am really curious, for I think there must be something convincing about it – other than my head coming off if I don't believe – since so many people, good and peaceful people, do believe in it... I would really like to hear a believer make a convincing case for islam.

[mikeJB]

whatever you beleive in and follow as long as it accompanies trust and love for your fellow man, care for Mother Earth and preserving goodness and innocence.........then worship whoever

[pe7erpark3r]

@Thales_BG said in Interfaith Conversations!:

Every Religion, to be considered one as a matter of fact has to have some sort of attempt of "reconnecting" the human being to a "higher entity" in order to give the fortunate individual another way to enjoy its life experience.

Buddhism is the odd exception that does not attempt to connect with a higher entity, except if you call nirvana a higher entity.

I dont think it was supposed to "bind" humanity together, except by the fact that all those "reconnected" humans would, logically, have the same goals and way of perceiving reality. So it was always about individualy achieving something greater than creating a "community" of sorts.

I don't think religion was meant.

Religions developed. They did however factually serve the purpose of uniting people, rituals bring people together. It's one of the reasons people in the west are so lonely today. We've given up our rituals, and conclusively the things that bring us together. I mean britain actually has it's own mistery that deals only with the acute lonelyness in the population.

And not every religion has a focus on the individual either. This is a western viewpoint, that has seeped so deeply into our bones that we almost cannot see the world in a different light. But many cultures, especially the asian cultures, put much more focus on the family or group. In japan you are basically nobody if you don't state for whom you work too. Being part of something makes you who you are.

IMO, that's human meddling.

I think I agree.

Every religion has that element of making an Individual closer to "something greater" than him, and transforming him in the process.

Agreed, this is present in every big religion.

[Silhouette]

@Div I second this initiative.

I believe that all faiths and religions are fundamentally similar. Every faith that has ever existed, from organized religions like Christianity and Hinduism to disorganized pagan religions, have a common core, which is to give us mortals a chance to reach divinity through arduous spiritual journeys. In a way, we all seek the same, we merely have different ways and rituals of doing so.

I admire Dharmic faiths, I really do. I admire their ancient roots, their perseverance and their rituals, which reflect spiritual clarity. If I was not a believer in Christ, I would quite possibly be a believer in Dharmic traditions.

I like this quote I found from a Sanskrit epic: "As a man himself sows, so he himself reaps; no man inherits the good or evil act of another man. The fruit is of the same quality as the action." How very true is that.

[pe7erpark3r]

So somebody made a per-religion pascal's wager. But like with most of memes about religions, those who make them really do not know what they are talking about. So here is the original:

First I'll have to add a disclaimer. I'm only an expert on catholicism, so I only corrected the first column. However I assume that the other columns, especially the christian and judeism columns need fixing too. I have no idea what Zoroastrianism says about this topic. And I do know that in hinduism everyone can get into heaven. Is there even hell in hinduism?

Of course I'll add a little explanation for you. Why are there questionmarks? Because here is what really get's you into heaven if the catholic faith is true:

Accepting Christ's Mercy

What does this mean? There is no way into heaven around Christ, for He is God's only son and our saviour. He pathed the Way into heaven for us and He is that Way.

"One Moment", you'll be thinking, didn't you just add a nice graphic showing that everyone can get into heaven, even if they don't believe in Christ?

Yes. The important part is the word "Accepting". In this life, if you really search for God, He will let you find Him. Without any doubt. Many even find Him without ever having searched, because of His Mercy. And when you meet Him, when you actually get a chance to meet the real Christ (in a spiritual way), then you have a choice: you can either accept Him or reject Him. You will do one of those two, inadvertantly.

However if you do not meet him, if you do not get a real chance to meet the real Christ, but instead hear a lot of falsities about the christian faith, then you have not really rejected Him. You only rejected the false image of God you encountered. Thus, when you die one day, you will get a chance to really meet Him, and then, you can decide.

But even if you meet Him and reject Him, you still have a chance, because we are humans, and we can change our minds. You are on the way to hell, but you always have a chance to convert and return to Him. He will never give you up until your last moment on earth and even up until your final decision, He will never give you up.

And last but not least, here is your surefire way to get into hell while being a "good christian": Simply continue on that way. For it's a lie in and of itself. There are no "good christians". If you are a "good christian" you do not need God's Mercy, and thus you are rejecting it.

[pe7erpark3r]

Maybe I'll need to add one more thing. Sin.

sin = not loving
loving = not sinning

We all will be judged for our sins (= our lack of love). And we all lack in love. Thus we all need Christ's Mercy.

Also

being in God & God being in you = loving

So love in this sense is not an emotion, it is trust in God and letting Him guide you. Which automatically results in you doing Love's will. Which is equal to "loving".

[pe7erpark3r]

@Div said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@pe7erpark3r
Currently reading this book to understand the similarities between christianity and dharma, cause after reading most of the book you recommended me(True life in god), I observed that there are indeed many intersection of ideas.

In the past days I've seen a few videos and read a few articles from hindu teachers about Christ. And I must say, I would advise you against learning from them about Christ. Some of them (not all) tend to distort the bible and christian teachings. And all of them look at Christ through the glasses of hinduism, which is their view, and fine of course, but if you want to get to know christianity as it actually is, I'd recommend another route.

Here is another similarity between hinduism and christianity: Disciplic Succession. I've learned it somewhat it from "Baghavat Gita as it is", and if I have understood correctly is that the gita and other holy texts, can be distorted by people who do not know how to interpret it properly. Thus disciplic succession from one guru to the next assures the correct interpretation.

The church knows a similar thing called apostolic succession. All bishops of the orthodox and catholic churches are in direct line from the apostles themselves. They have been ordained and tought by the bishops before them. They are not exactly like gurus because their job is not just to teach but to also take care of the whole flock (all christian believers). But it is the same kind of idea as disciplic succession.

And then there is the other thing, Jesus' promise, that the Holy Spirit would remind those, who love God, of the Truth. So the route I would advise you, would of course be, to read at least the gospels to get to know the son of man's actions in the world and his parables, which are quite enlightening, and then to read stories about the Saints, like St. Padre Pio or St. Jean Marie Vianney, St. Theresa of Avila, St. Francis. Because the saints are those who loved God the most, and thus the Holy Spirit is with them the strongest.

Also, I often heard in those videos from the hindu teaches about the original teachings of Christ that were lost. You will find, that when you hear the saint's words and read about their lives, that the "original teachings" were in fact not lost at all but very much alive throughout all of the centuries. In fact St. Francis (11th century) is called (even by christian denominations who do not venerate the saints) the saint who is most Christ-like.

[pe7erpark3r]

@Div said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@pe7erpark3r said in Interfaith Conversations!:

First I'll have to add a disclaimer. I'm only an expert on catholicism, so I only corrected the first column. However I assume that the other columns, especially the christian and judeism columns need fixing too. I have no idea what Zoroastrianism says about this topic. And I do know that in hinduism everyone can get into heaven. Is there even hell in hinduism?

This is a great summary!
Aham brahmasami
And let me tag the elephant in the room, which shared the given meme in the first place and who should read this beautiful explanation, @TagUjjwal there ya go!

Thanks bud... Is there really supposed to be a place where all tha brahmans then live? or was that krishna again?

[Silhouette]

@AllAboutGay Don't mock other people's beliefs, shirtlifter. Stop spreading deceit.

[Silhouette]

@AllAboutGay

LGBT is in no way deceit

Yes it is. It is an artificial and a hedonistic way of life. It is akin to spitting in the face of all that is natural.

Now, I am not personally interested in a crusade against gay people - if you've chosen to live in sin, it does not concern me personally. However, your constant attempts to force your beliefs upon other users on this site forces me to take a stand, and I stand on the side of normal human sexuality.

Tell me, is being gay all you have going on for you? Must you define yourself through your wickedness? Do you not have any depth as a person?

[pe7erpark3r]

@Div said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@pe7erpark3r said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@Div said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@pe7erpark3r said in Interfaith Conversations!:

First I'll have to add a disclaimer. I'm only an expert on catholicism, so I only corrected the first column. However I assume that the other columns, especially the christian and judeism columns need fixing too. I have no idea what Zoroastrianism says about this topic. And I do know that in hinduism everyone can get into heaven. Is there even hell in hinduism?

This is a great summary!
Aham brahmasami
And let me tag the elephant in the room, which shared the given meme in the first place and who should read this beautiful explanation, @TagUjjwal there ya go!

Thanks bud... Is there really supposed to be a place where all tha brahmans then live? or was that krishna again?

I dont know? 😕

We are trying to understand the unimaginable with our current extremely limited knowledge of nature. If I try to explain you the world after death of the body in terms of mass, I wouldn't be able to. Because this mass we see and experience is nothing but Higgs bosons interacting with the Higgs field, now can you see a field directly? No right, we can just experience it with our limited senses. And Einstein's equation clearly also says that mass is nothing more than condensed energy, right. I dont know how energy is like, none of us do.
Now if we try to understand the afterlife in terms of time. Then, what is time but a relative measurement of the distance traveled by the speed of light. Again, it is relative to energy.
The more science you read, the more you'll understand that all we are learning is just application of that single concept. The single concept, which I can not explain, I'm sorry. 😕

Yeah, I get that I won't get that :joy:

However you might be able to explain the concept to me, that was expressed in the video. The video depicted an unimaginable world into which the Brahman's will all go one day, when they have lived enough lives. My question is not how this unimaginable world looks like or what it means. I just want to know wether that is the actual idea.

Or is the idea rather, that a Brahman will live it's billions of years lifetime, then return to the one god, only to be reborn when god wants to remake the world?

Or are there actually different teachings about this?

[pe7erpark3r]

@Silhouette said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@AllAboutGay

LGBT is in no way deceit

Yes it is. It is an artificial and a hedonistic way of life. It is akin to spitting in the face of all that is natural.

Now, I am not personally interested in a crusade against gay people - if you've chosen to live in sin, it does not concern me personally. However, your constant attempts to force your beliefs upon other users on this site forces me to take a stand, and I stand on the side of normal human sexuality.

Tell me, is being gay all you have going on for you? Must you define yourself through your wickedness? Do you not have any depth as a person?

Don't take our poor gay troll to seriously dude :joy:

[pe7erpark3r]

Islamic Signs of the End Times

In Islam, a number of major and minor signs foretell the end of days. There is debate over whether they could occur concurrently or must be at different points in time, although Islamic scholars typically divide them into three major periods.

1. Sexual immorality appears among people to such an extent that they commit it openly, except that they will be afflicted by plagues and diseases unknown to their forefathers;

Both are true today.

General concerns: Every culture in the last 3000 years that was not wiped out by war, but died by itself, showed loss of sexual morality as one of it's symptoms of it's close death. There have always appeared plagues and diseases unknown to previous generations.

Biblical parallels: The old testament is full of instances where sinful behaviour leads to plagues and diseases. The new testament profecies sexual immorality at the end times as well as plagues and diseases.

2. People cheat in weights and measures (business, trades, etc.) and are stricken with famine, calamity, and oppression as a result;

Both are true today.

General concerns: People have always cheated in weights and measures.

Biblical parallels: In Amos 8, God speaks against the people who cheat in weights and measures. He threatens them with calamity, famine, thirst, death.

3. They withhold charity and hoard their wealth, and rain is withheld from the sky from them; there is rain only for animals;

Those sins are being commited today. Droughts are getting more frequent with global warming. However animals are not excepted.

General concerns: People have always withheld their charity and hoarded their weath. There have always been droughts around the world.

Biblical parallels: In Jeremiah 14 God threatens His people with drought, famine, sword (war) due to their sins.

4. They break their covenant with God and His Messenger and God enables their enemies to overpower them and take some of what is in their hands;

Biblical parallels: Whenever isreal breaks the covenant with God (many many times in OT), they are as a result overpowered by their enemies, and some (if not most) of what is in their hands is taken away.

5. God causes those who do not live according to His book to fight among themselves.

General concerns: Those who do not live morally tend to fight (more) among themselves (than those who try to live a moral life). In fact people fight among themselves, period.

Major Signs

Following the second period, the third will be marked by the ten major signs known as alamatu's-sa'ah al-kubra (the major signs of the end).[note 2] They are as follows:

None of the major signs have happened yet. So this is true for them all.

1. The false messiah—anti-Christ, Masih ad-Dajjal—shall appear with great powers as a one-eyed man with his right eye blind and deformed like a grape. Although believers will not be deceived, he will claim to be God, to hold the keys to heaven and hell, and will lead many astray.[16] In reality, his heaven is hell, and his hell is heaven. The Dajjal will be followed by seventy thousand Jews of Isfahan wearing Persian shawls.[note 3]

Biblical parallels: The anti christ is a biblical concept. The bible says he'll appear at the end of times, and will lead many astray. He will claim to be God, and lead many to hell.

2. The return of Isa (Jesus), from the fourth sky, to kill Dajjal.[17]

Bilical parallels: At the end of times Jesus will return, as he left, on the clouds of the sky.

3. Ya'jooj and Ma'jooj (Gog and Magog), a Japhetic tribe of vicious beings who had been imprisoned by Dhul-Qarnayn, will break out. They will ravage the earth, drink all the water of Lake Tiberias, and kill all believers in their way. Isa, Imam Al-Mahdi, and the believers with them will go to the top of a mountain and pray for the destruction of Gog and Magog. God eventually will send disease and worms to wipe them out.[note 4][18]

/

4. A huge black cloud of smoke will cover the earth.[note 5]

Biblical parallels: Mt 24:29 "Immediately after the distress of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken."

5. The Dabbat al-ard, or Beast of the Earth, will come out of the ground to talk to people.[note 6]

Biblical parallels: Revelation 13:11 "And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon."

6. The sun will rise from the west.[19][20]

/

7. Three sinkings of the earth, one in the east,[note 7] one in the west,[note 8] and one in Arabia.[note 9]

/

8. The second blow of the trumpet will be sounded, the dead will return to life, and a fire will come out of Yemen that shall gather all to Mahshar Al Qiy'amah (The Gathering for Judgment).[21]

Biblical parallels: In the book of revelation the trumpets that are sounded by the angels ring in the different phases of the apocalypse. Including the resurrection of the dead. Fire is one of the profeciesed things to happen.

Minor Signs

1. The coming of fitna (tribulations) and removal of khushoo' (fearfulness of God, taqwah, reverence, etc.)[note 10]

Biblical parallels: The bible predicts that in the end times the fearfullness of God would diminish, faith would diminish, tribulations would come.

2. The coming of Dajjal, presuming himself as an apostle of God.[note 11][jargon]

Biblical parallels: we have already seen that the anti christ is a biblical concept.

3. A person passing by a grave might say to another the following: "I wish it were my abode."[note 12]

Biblical parallels:

Ecclesiastes 4:2 "I envy those who are dead and gone; they are better off than those who are still alive."

Revelation 6:12-17 "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, see, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, even as a fig tree casts her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every slave, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"

4. The loss of honesty, as well as authority put in the hands of those who do not deserve it.[note 13]

True today.

General concerns: Rise of immorality has always preceded the fall of every society. This includes loss of honesty, corrupt leaders. There has been an innumerable amount of leaders who do not deserve to have authority throughout all of history.

5. The loss of knowledge and the prevalence of religious ignorance.[note 14]

True today, especially in the christian world.

Biblical parallels: Luke 18:8 However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?"

6. Frequent, sudden, and unexpected deaths.[note 15]

True today.

General concerns: As it was always. Sometimes more often, sometimes less often. People are at war since the beginning of time.

This might still lay in the future though.

7. Increase in pointless killings.[note 16]

Seemingly true today.

General concerns: Is there a single war in human history that was not pointless? Is it true, that relatively more people die today, or are there simply more people and thus more are killed?

This might still lay in the future though.

8. Acceleration of time.[note 17]

Not true today. What might it mean?

9. Rejection of Hadith.[note 18]

According to the video this is true today.

General concerns: It is very much to be expected that tradition will be rejected at one point in history. Things like that eventually happen.

Biblical parallels: Luke 18:8 However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?"

10. The spread of riba (usury, interest), zina (adultery, fornication), and the drinking of alcohol.[note 19]

True today.

The first one is something that indeed is reserved to the last 300 years. This profecy is notable.

The second one is to be expected, as noted above. The third one was always the case in the western world, but it might become true in the muslim world.

11. Widespread acceptance of music.[note 20]

This is true, and according to the video it is especially true for the islamic world.

General concerns: There was already a widespread acceptance of music at muhammad's time. Just not where he lived. Any realist might have said that.

12. Pride and competition in the decoration of mosques.[note 21]

Certainly came true.

General concerns: This is the way of people. Greed, wealth, it's what we do. I would call anybody naive who would not have expected this.

13. Women will increase in number and men will decrease in number so much so that fifty women will be looked after by one man.[note 22]

Has not (yet) happened.

14. Abundance of earthquakes.[note 23]

Earthquakes have not increased statistically AFAIK (yet).

Biblical parallels: Rev 6 "and every mountain and island were moved out of their places"

Isaiah 29:6 From the LORD of hosts you will be punished with thunder and earthquake and loud noise, With whirlwind and tempest and the flame of a consuming fire.

15. Frequent occurrences of disgrace, distortion, and defamation.[note 24]

True today.

General concerns: This has always been rather popular :joy:

16. When people wish to die because of the severe trials and tribulations that they are suffering.[note 25]

True today.

Biblical parallels: Revelation 6:16f "And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every slave, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"

17. Jews fighting Muslims.[note 26]

True today.

General concerns: ... as it was in the time of muhammad himself...

18. When paying charity becomes a burden.[note 27]

True today, especially in the western world. Any kind of commitment without pay is in decline.

General concerns: As noted above, every society in history that died by itself, did first lose it's morals, including of course charitable works.

19. Nomads will compete in the construction of very tall buildings.[note 28]

This one is indeed remarkable, as it is today more true than ever before.

General concerns: People have always tried to build the highest temples/churches/palaces, higher than all the times before them.

Biblical parallels: The tower of babel was built by peoples who were nomads before. So this profecy has even become true thousands of years before it was spoken...

20. Women will appear naked despite their being dressed.[note 29]

True today.

General concerns: Looking at belly dancers today, one must imagine, that even in muhammad's times there were women who appeared naked despite their being dressed.

21. People will seek knowledge from misguided and straying scholars.[note 30]

True today. Maybe, just maybe a bit more than in past times.

General concerns: This has always been true.

Biblical parallels: Matthew 15:14 "Leave them; they are blind guides. If the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a pit."

22. Liars will be believed, honest people disbelieved, and faithful people called traitors.[note 31]

True today. Especially in the Christian world.

Biblical parallels: Mt 5:10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

23. The death of righteous, knowledgeable people.[note 32]

True today.

General concerns: All people die. The righteous were murdered throughout all centuries, before muhammad and after muhammad.

24. The emergence of indecency (obscenity) and enmity among relatives and neighbours.[note 33]

True today.

General concerns: Same point as above: all societies in history died out when morality dropped.

25. The rise of idolatry and polytheists in the community.[note 34]

True today, especially if you consider modern idols like money, fame, sex, power. Also a rise of esotericism.

Biblical parallels: Rev 13:4 And they worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast, and who can fight against it?”

26. The Euphrates will uncover a mountain of gold.[note 35]

Has not happened (yet) to my knowledge.

27. The land of the Arabs will return to being a land of rivers and fields.[note 36]

Was it that before? Is it now? Maybe it will :shrug:

28. People will increasingly earn money by unlawful (Haram) ways.[note 37]

Morality rises and falls throughout history, before and after muhammad. And as noted above, every society in history died through declining morals.

29. There will be much rain but little vegetation.[note 38]

True today in some places. Due to deforestation.

General concerns: The romans deforested the mediteranean see. These effects were well known long before the time of muhammad.

30. Evil people will be expelled from Al-Madinah.[note 39]

Is this happening?

31. Wild animals will communicate with humans, and humans will communicate with objects.[note 40]

These are the actual words:

"By the One in whose hand is my soul, the Hour will not commence until predators speak to people, and until the tip of a man’s whip and the straps on his sandals speak to him, and his thigh informs him of what occurred with his family after he left."

Which is being interpreted by people as technology decoding animal's noises and shoes having sensors. Of course this happens. Thus this one is in a way notable.

General concerns: My thighs will never inform me of what occurred with my family. This kind of technology makes no sense. But, there might be something, that could be interpreted in this way one day, as it is being does with the other parts of this profecy.

32. Lightning and thunder will become more prevalent.[note 41]

Biblical parallels: Revelation 8:5 Then the angel took the censer and filled it with the fire of the altar, and threw it to the earth; and there followed peals of thunder and sounds and flashes of lightning and an earthquake.

33. There will be a special greeting for people of distinction.[note 42]

True today.

General concerns: Has always been the case, even in the times and region of muhammad.

34. Trade will become so widespread that a woman will help her husband in business.[note 43]

True today.

35. No truly honest man will remain and no one will be trusted.[note 44]

Not yet come true IMHO.

36. Only the worst people will be left; they will not know any good nor forbid any evil (i.e. No one will say there is no god but Allah).[note 45]

Has not come true yet IMHO.

37. Nations will call each other to destroy Islam by any and every means.[note 46]

Crucades. However the point of the crusades was not to destroy islam but to free the Holy Land. Maybe it will still happen?

38. Islamic knowledge will be passed on, but no one will follow it correctly.[note 47]

Might still happen.

39. Muslim rulers will come who do not follow the guidance and tradition of the Sunnah. Some of their men will have the hearts of devils in a human body.[note 48]

True today.

General concerns: Any realist would expect that to happen eventually.

40. Stinginess will become more widespread and honorable people will perish.[note 49]

I'm getting tired :yawn:

41. A man will obey his wife and disobey his mother, and treat his friend kindly while shunning his father.[note 50]

There were always people who did that. Is it more widespread today?

42. Voices will be raised in the mosques.[note 51]

Despite being forbidden, this seems to happen these days.

43. The leader of a people will be the worst of them.[note 52]

True in many places today. Has happened countless times in history before and after muhammad.

44. People will treat a man with respect because they fear the evil he could do.[note 53]

True. Has always been true.

45. Much wine will be drunk.[note 54]

True. Has always been true, except in the islamic world.

46. Muslims shall fight against a nation who wear shoes made of hair and with faces like hammered shields, with red complexions and small eyes.[note 55]

Has not happened as to my knowledge. Will they fight american indians? What might "faces like hammered shields" mean?

47. The emergence of the Sufyani within the Syria region.[note 56]

No idea.

48. The truce and joint Roman-Muslim campaign against a common enemy, followed by al-Malhama al-Kubra (Armageddon), a Roman vs. Muslim war.[note 57]

Has this happened? If not it will not, for the romans are no more :shrug:

49. The Black Standard will come from Khorasan, (see Hadith of black flags) nothing shall turn them back until it is planted in Jerusalem.[note 58]

People who know this will do this, when they get the opportunity.

50. There will be disagreement concerning succession.

There has been a disagreement concerning succession since muhammad's death. Shiites vs. Sunites.

51. Then a man will emerge from Madina. He will hurry to Makkah, and the people of Makkah will come out to him and urge him and try to force him to accept the Bai'aa.[note 59]

Has this happened?

52. Mecca will be attacked and the Kaaba will be destroyed.[note 60]

Might happen still.

53. Emergence of an army, from Yemen, that will make Islam dominant.[note 61][22]

Might happen still.

One of the last of the minor signs, and which will signal the coming of the 10 Major signs
54. The appearance of the Mahdi.[23][24][25][26]

Apparently has happened at least 10 times. But yeah, any great islamic leader might fit the role.

In summary there are many predictions that any realist would have made. Then there are lots of predictions which are parallels to the much older bible. And then there are predictions that seem rather notable:

• the communication with objects and animals
• the spread of riba (usury, interest)
• the construction of high buildings by (former) nomadic peoples

Well... nobody would expect communication with objects and animals. This one is the oddest. The other two might be something a realist could expect.

But I must admit, that now I know about something that could convince people of the truth of islam.

I kind of like the fact, that muslims expect Jesus to come back. For, when Jesus comes back, he will certainly be able to tell us beyond any doubt, wether islam was right or christianity :joy:

[pe7erpark3r]

Let me quote part of an article that explained some predictions of muhammad coming true:

Only the Creator of time, as we know it, is not restricted by it. Only God has full access to the forgotten past and unseen future. Supposed psychics and fortune-tellers either speak in ways that carry a thousand potential interpretations (from which the most “accurate” is claimed after the fact) or get exposed as frauds over time (as eventually, their guesses are more often wrong than right). As for predicting specifics about the future while never erring, that is only possible for the Knower of the Unseen, and whoever He may grant partial access to the unseen world. “[He is] Knower of the unseen, and He does not disclose His [knowledge of the] unseen to anyone—except whom He has approved of messengers…” [al-Jinn 72: 26-27] Al-Qāḍi ‘Eyāḍ (d. 1149) says, “The hadith(s) in this regard are a bottomless ocean and an unending stream. They are one of his miracles which are undeniably established, transmitted to us by tawâtur (abundant recurrence), due to their many narrators and the concordance of their meanings, all corroborating the fact that he ﷺ was privy to [some of] the unseen.”[1] In this paper, we will take a dive into this bottomless ocean, exploring its wonders, namely some of the events foretold by the Prophet Muhammad ﷺ which are among the greatest testimonies to his prophethood.

According to islam muhammad was the last prophet. So there should not be any true profecy after him. However the children of fatima apparently predicted WWI and many of the events preceding and following. And TLIG predicted the fall of the world trade center. Or am I misunderstanding islam here? Is authentic profecy after muhammad compatible with islam?

[Silhouette]

@pe7erpark3r He attacked me, so I attacked back. If he's a troll, he's an exceptionally unfunny troll.

[mahaiia]

This post is deleted!

[Silhouette]

@AllAboutGay Fine. I'm done arguing with you, nutcase.

[pe7erpark3r]

@Silhouette said in Interfaith Conversations!:

@pe7erpark3r He attacked me, so I attacked back. If he's a troll, he's an exceptionally unfunny troll.

Why can't you look through the trolling, overstylized, gay facade? You shouldn't fell attacked by somebody who is caricaturing gayness... Also he's clearly muslim. He might be gay too, but I think the account once named AllAboutHetero is also his...